I’m no Jeremy Clarkson (let’s get that straight…)
But I am a bit of a petrol head. I like fast things, mostly bikes. People ask how I can be both a petrol head and an environmentalist – fair question. Well nobody’s perfect, I’m certainly not. We all live in the real world, the one in which we make compromises and promises to do better, and occasionally do do the things we know in principle, it would be better if we didn’t. Life and the need to live a better (zero carbon) one is a journey, there’s no overnight solution and we shouldn’t beat ourselves up over things we can’t change right now. That said, by the way, I only did 3,000 miles in a car last year, I’m getting to grips with it.
Transport is one of the really big issues we have to face up to – how are we all going to get around, post oil and post carbon?
I think the answer is electric cars, cars charged using wind energy - in fact I prefer to think of them as wind powered cars.
We’re building one right now – a car to smash the stereotype of looking like something Noddy would drive. An out and out sports car. Capable of 0 to 60 faster than a V12 Ferrari, able to top 100 mph for sure – and do 150 miles on one ‘tank’. All with zero emissions. Cake and eat it. Petrol head meets zerocarbonista.
We’re making this car with technology available in the world today. Throwing down the gauntlet to the big car companies. If we can do it – why (the hell) can’t you?
Work is underway, I expect this car on the road for the summer.
We’re keeping a film record as we go, hoping we might make this into a film for TV, if not definitely for our web site.
Watch this space! And Clarkson beware, or maybe not. I’ve a feeling he might like it…
e2a: check out the little clip of the video intro
to be honest I am in two minds about this - in the first place I’m happy with the idea of electric cars, and well done for only doing 3000 miles last year too - I didnt manage that.
But the thing that concerns me about this kind of product is that it becomes subject to the whim of fashion, its a consumable item, and doesn’t encourage a less materialistic, less consumption based lifestyle - and that’s what got us into this mess in the first place.
To my mind it seems more appropriate to look at increasing sustainability and availability of mass public transport, creating this kind of electric vehicle is only ever going to serve a small minority of the population, and thus will make less of a positive impact.
I am not really having a go at you though, its only by challenging the big companies that changes will be made, and for that reason (if that alone) I hope this succeeds.
Cheers, Simon
Comment by Rhymin Simon — April 24, 2008 @ 9:32 am
0 to 60 in 3.9 seconds.
200 miles per charge.
Makes a corvette look ugly.
TeslaMotors.com
Comment by midnight skuller — April 24, 2008 @ 9:59 am
Still electric delivery and car share vehicles provide a useful “network battery” for Wind power.
Comment by Me — April 24, 2008 @ 3:07 pm
Talk to Project Better Place http://www.projectbetterplace.com
They already have a commitment from Renault-Nissan to mass produce electric cars for Israel and Denmark. I’ve no doubt we will see them come to the UK as well.
In particular they seem keen to use renewable energy to power the electric cars. In Denmark they are using spare capacity from the wind.
It would be great to see Ecotricity supply the energy for Project Better Place in the UK
Comment by Simon — April 24, 2008 @ 5:03 pm
Comment by Wobbly Dave — April 25, 2008 @ 8:41 am
Electric vehicles are the way forwards, you can still get the same thrill from riding/driving. There are a lot more coming onto the market, and as we all know when demand increases so does supply and costs reduce.
The other advantage is you can charge directly from wind or solar and fuel is then free. Something else to note is even if you take your power from the mains you only pay 5% VAT…..the Government sting you for about 188% VAT on your ‘traditional’ fuel. This will never change, and they can’t increase VAT on electric as so many older people area reliant on cheap energy to heat their homes.
Very interested to see the Lotus in the flesh….will give you a race on my Vectrix!
Comment by Mark Loveridge — April 27, 2008 @ 10:25 am
I also think that in the modern world we need some form of independent transport (as well as better public transport!). I’m unmarried with no kids, living on the edge of a big city. Yet even I find I need a car. So I can only imagine how much harder it would be for a mother of three, or a freelance business consultant, or a country bumpkin to survive without a car. Having said all that, without wishing to rain on this fantastic movement (and it is truely fantastic), .. I’m a bit concerned these electric cars are becoming a product for the ‘elite’. I like the fact that this car shows up all those pathetic big car manufacturers who say ‘it’s impossible’! The impressive specs will obviously be sweep that myth under the carpet. But it sounds almost like a tesla or the lightning. Does that mean it will have a tesla or a lightning price?
Like I say, I’m seriously impressed, and love that Ecotricity are investing in something I believe in,… but if you can achieve such overwhelming highs, then surely you must also have the passion, drive and technology to achieve a standard 4 door, reliable, affordable hatchback??! Whens that coming?! With petrol prices today, you KNOW it will sell!!
Congrats though Dale. That’s great news.
Comment by Chris — April 29, 2008 @ 9:49 am
Personally (as an Ecotricity staffer)- I am hoping that the Lotus is so cost-effective and efficient that Ecotricity get a fleet of them for staff use
In all seriousness - I would be happy driving a ‘noddy’ car around though - I love driving fast cars like most people, but for getting to work, doing the shopping and school runs etc an electric/compressed air/hybrid vehicle is fine, I think I can live with being called ‘Big Ears’… until I can afford one of these beauties of course!
@Mark - I would also use a Vectrix to get to work if I had the spare pennies (and if the sun was out!)
Comment by paul — April 29, 2008 @ 10:57 am
@Rhymin Simon – Thanks Simon, understand what you’re saying. We need better mass transport, I’m with you there. On that front we’ve an electric London bus on the drawing board (after the tractor), the sports car is just the start. One of the big ideas behind the car is to show that there is a future where we can live with zero emissions and still live life a bit as we know it – I think that’s essential to get the majority of people on board, without them we can’t do it. We need to turn some heads. Cheers.
@Midnight Skuller – Thanks for the stats, it’s worth perhaps saying though that these are predictions for performance, they’ve not been delivered – not after five years and $150 Million of development money. With the gearbox being dropped recently performance is expected to drop big time, but we’ll see, when one of these finally hits the road. The PR is way ahead of the delivery right now. But I’m rooting for it. We’re going to spend a tiny (tiny) fraction of the time and money, and make a better car – because we think we can.
@Simon – Thanks Simon, I did get your e-mail, just didn’t manage to reply yet (sorry about that). Thanks for the tip, we’re up for supplying their cars, if it takes off over here. Cheers.
Comment by dale — May 2, 2008 @ 8:18 am
Comment by oly — May 2, 2008 @ 1:24 pm
I am not saying electric cars are bad, but simply replacing current cars with electric is not the solution.
Comment by Neil — May 2, 2008 @ 1:30 pm
There is a wider issue here. To improve the range and performance of a car, you need to either get a better powertrain (more power and/or better batteries) or get the weight down, or some combination of both. If you get the weight down, then at what expense? It could be taking luxuries out, such as power windows, air-conditioning, stereo etc., or degrading durability or safety. I’m not sure everyone would feel comfortable driving a car knowing that safety was compromised. That said, if someone wanted safety, they would not be looking at a sports car. In sports cars luxuries are often left out anyway, so I imagine you can get away with not putting in power windows, a/c and all that.
I’m interested to know more about this car like how much it will weigh, how many and what kind of batteries it will have etc.
Anyway I’m looking forward to seeing the car, and seeing if it really does give the performance and range you promise, and what (if anything) is compromised in order to get it.
Good on you Dale though. It’s not often that I see an electricity company try to develop and build a car!
Comment by Jeff — May 2, 2008 @ 2:40 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fuZShCmN8s
Comment by Chris — May 4, 2008 @ 3:06 pm
@ Jeff – Thanks Jeff, some good points in there, our car will def pass a crash test, but is at the sports car end of the range when it comes to comfort and such like. More details to follow. Cheers.
@ Neil – You’re right. In energy we argue that green electricity and energy efficiency are two sides of the same coin – we need to use less and what we must use should come from green sources. I think the same logic applies to transport, we need to travel less and when we do travel it needs to be by cleaner means. Electric cars won’t be the magic single answer but will play an important role. Cheers.
@ all
There’ve been some good points made about the cost of the kind of car we’re planning, it’s affordability and the desirability of a more everyday car. No argument from me on any of that but I just wanted to offer this perspective as to why we’re starting with a high end sports car.
The first thing to say is we want to turn heads with this, we want to crush the stereotype of electric cars being Noddy cars and of green lifestyles being boring and about sacrifice.
Secondly the technology exists today (we think) to achieve the performance goals we’ve set, provided we use a small light car as a platform. That could be a sports car or a city car granted, but - the technology is not cheap and it’s doesn’t get cheaper if you aim for less performance, so it makes sense to wrap it in a more exotic package, where the performance will (more) justify the price tag. Like mobile phones and laptops, if the idea catches on the technology will move more rapidly, the price will drop and the products will move more into the mainstream. It’s a starting place. And it works (well we hope it will) at the high performance end, right now. Cheers.
Comment by dale — May 6, 2008 @ 8:52 am
Thanks
Martin
Comment by Martin Buckley — May 6, 2008 @ 9:38 am
Actually Lotus are providing technology to Tesla (there was an “In-Business” programme on the radio about it last year). Lotus has a very strong heritage in building high performance and light weight cars that handle very well - in fact that use to be the mantra of Colin Chapman (their founder).
Lotus were displaying a battery-powered Elise at an event at the National Motor Museum around 2 years ago. I think it’s a very good area for them to be putting R&D spend into, providing they have the cashflow to survive a long haul.
I do agree with other people here that fundamentally mass transportation will have to change radically - we won’t simply be able to replace petrol/diesel with electric.
Comment by Simon300 — May 12, 2008 @ 10:04 am
Comment by Jon — May 14, 2008 @ 9:08 am
Comment by Mark Kiernan — May 19, 2008 @ 8:30 pm
[...] now he wants a fast, wind-powered electric car that will rival Tesla’s Roadster. Game on - ZeroCarbonista via [...]
Pingback by The Daily Sprout « Earth2Tech — May 20, 2008 @ 12:30 am
[...] our wind powered car we’re throwing down the gauntlet to the big car companies, who aren’t doing nearly enough. They [...]
Pingback by Ecotricity: from wind powered car to plug-in petrol « benkeene.com — June 3, 2008 @ 11:37 am
Any plans for an electric bike? Please can you include that sweet bike sound so that people talking on the phone whilst driving their electric cars can hear us coming.
Comment by Glenn — June 5, 2008 @ 7:01 pm
Spoiler
Comment by Paul — July 22, 2008 @ 9:43 am
Although it’s clearly nice to visit family, it’s not a *need* like food or water or heat. You wouldn’t die if you had to use the Internet for phone for a year instead. (Some families would improve with distance too. B^>)
We’ve all gotten too used to regarding ‘nice’ things as ‘essential’.
Rgds
Damon
Comment by Damon Hart-Davis — July 22, 2008 @ 10:42 am
@ Paul - Dropping cars is not an option even in little old Europe - we’re talking about cars powered by renewable energy sources and the future of filling stations. Your 1500 mile example is for a once a year holiday. For the rest of the time, like getting to work and back, even to the Mall - we’re looking at electric cars with round trip ranges of 400 miles - surely your job and the Mall are closer than that! And we’re talking about charging these cars at home (and at the Mall) - not dropping cars, dropping oil companies and filling stations. That’s something inevitable. The status quo can’t be maintained, oil is running out - life as we ALL know it will change. You could always move to Europe though, for the better holidays…
Cheers.
Comment by dale — July 23, 2008 @ 8:39 am
How much would it cost to charge one? As even if it did 150 miles on one charge, someone like me would still need to charge it once a week.
And how much would it cost to buy an electric car?
One other thing I’m intrigued by is if you wanted to drive further than 150 miles in one go (on holiday for example), how would that be possible? There are no (or very few) charging points around, and I imagine it’s not like a mobile phone where you can just plug an ac adapter into a wall socket…
If my questions seem a bit simple, please excuse me… I’m kinda new to all this…
Comment by Xena — July 28, 2008 @ 9:05 am
Hope it’s not just an ego boosting publicity gimik! (I’ll tell ya about gimiks!)
Oly
Comment by oly — July 29, 2008 @ 8:05 am
@ Xena - It’s early days to be certain on numbers, but the indications are that you could probably get 5,000 miles on 1 MWh of electricity (to charge your car) and that would probably cost say £150 in round numbers - that works out at about 3p per mile at peak rates or closer to 1p per mile if you charged on economy seven (cheap overnight electricity).
Buying an electric car right now wouldn’t be cheap at all, not the kind we’re discussing here anyway. My best guess is that currently it’d cost between 100k and 150k - but these are early prototypes in small scale production. Just like the cost of the first mobiles or laptops the price will crash as production ramps up.
As for charging the scenario envisaged here is that garages would cease to exist and instead charging points would be available in supermarket, public and motorway car parks. These new generation batteries can be charged in around 20 minutes, so say, in which case on a long journey you’d just need to stop for a break somewhere with a charging point. That’s the scenario. Today there are virtually no charging facilities and very few cars like this on the road. This will change.
Hope that helps. Cheers.
Comment by dale — July 29, 2008 @ 8:18 am
I hope things will change. I would gladly swap my car for an EV if they become more mass-produced (and therefore cheaper) and I guess that if the figures you’re quoting are fairly near to the mark it sounds like they would be slightly cheaper to run as well.
I resent paying for petrol… the petrol prices and the taxes that our delightful government stick on top of the fuel are completely ridiculous… it’s like we’re being made to pay through the nose to destroy our own planet. I can’t see the sense in that.
I get public transport anywhere I can to help the environment, but I am not perfect and I have to have a car for certain journeys.
The main issues for me with transport in general are firstly the welfare of this earth and its future, or course, and secondly in this current climate I, along with everyone else, am increasingly concerned about the cost of transport and the cost of living in general.
I hope you’re right in saying that things will change… and that they change for the better.
Comment by Xena — July 29, 2008 @ 10:31 am
@ oly - The problem with Noddy and Clarkson you ask? - Well one’s a kind of cute but ineffectual cuddly fool and the other is a children’s character who drives naff cars…
The car is under construction, going to update on that shortly.
It’s not a ‘gimik’ but it is about boosting publicity, to get people thinking and talking about how we’ll all be getting around in the near future, and to introduce the idea of a wind powered car.
Cheers.
Comment by dale — July 29, 2008 @ 3:10 pm
You can’t stop people wanting to drive fast cars, to take risks, to feel excited about beautiful objects. Unfortunately, currently, those feelings are umbilically linked to pollution and bad effects for us all.
I think this is the way forward, its much more likely that the ‘green’ brand will be taken up by the popular culture if we have flagships like very fast (inexpensive to run) cars.
It is not a luxury to create these items, but a necessity to replace them.
Comment by Paul Harwood — July 30, 2008 @ 8:56 am
He quoted to me possibly one of the most alarming statistics showing just how far we have got to go to rein in our unsustainable lifestyles.
It goes like this:-
If the total UK road vehicle fleet were powered by electricity instead of fossil fuel, we would need the equivalent of 46 additional nuclear power stations (over and above those that are already being proposed).
It is not going to happen, for so many reasons. So I suppose unless we can build several thousand multi-MW turbines most of us will have to bicycle around the M25 instead. Sadly, electric cars are likely to be rich men’s toys.
Comment by Jonny Holt — August 21, 2008 @ 6:28 pm
Battery technology is improving at a rapid rate, with capacitors now being mated with batteries to provide a more rounded solution. These developments mean the batteries, in time will need less energy to charge, and propel vehicles for longer on a charge. There are also workings to make regenerative braking more effective, reducing the amount of times you need to charge.
Also, as solar costs come down, you can charge at your own ‘home station’.
None of this will happen without the investment, and consumers need to buy into this now to help aid its process. There are huge cost savings for those that do.
If we reduce the amount of vehicles on the road, reduce the amount of miles we do in them we will be half way to resolving the issue. But electric isn’t the sole fuel of the future. There is also Hydrogen, although currently the energy intensity to create hydrogen is high- with further development this could change.
In a nutshell- don’t be put off by these huge figures. Electric power is happening, it’s happening now and is leading technological advances for the future!
If you want to go electric now, see http://www.vectrix.co.uk
Comment by Mark Loveridge — August 22, 2008 @ 8:30 am
Car manufacturers sell oil!
Why else would there be 19th c. technology under each bonnet?
There’ll soon be more small companies offering practical, fully electric cars.
We need to support these small suppliers in the same way we need to support smaller suppliers of food to try and stop supermarkets pimping out the planet to the big bidders.
Comment by oly — August 22, 2008 @ 9:47 am
Comment by oly — October 6, 2008 @ 9:52 pm
Thanks for the tip Oly - you’re right we’d have no shortage of customers if we undercut the market, we’d probably go out of business though, which wouldn’t be very useful…
Seriously though, we plan for the day when we produce enough of our own power to separate from the market and charge our customers less - a lot of work to do to get there.
Cheers.
Comment by dale — October 7, 2008 @ 9:29 am
Is it possible to seperate from the market but still use the grid to distribute the electricity?
I think localized clean generation would mean more security and stability.
Ever thought about branching out into that area?
Seems like at the moment you’re at the mercy of the government and the grid.
Also, like I said about car companies selling oil, I think it would be in your interest to sell electric cars.
I’m just worried about people like you chaps getting squeezed out!
Comment by Oly — October 7, 2008 @ 11:09 am
Hi Oly, it def is possible to use the grid but detach ourselves (not totally) from the crazy market. That’s where we hope to get to.
I appreciate the concern, I’m certain though that we won’t get squeezed out. Too many people don’t buy into what the big guys say and do, and the number keeps growing. It’s the big guys that should be worried…
Especially the oil companies… Cheers.
Comment by dale — October 13, 2008 @ 4:02 pm